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	<title>Comments on: Making the Royals Contenders &#8211; Part 1</title>
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	<description>Deconstructing The Process</description>
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		<title>By: Gavin</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9406</link>
		<dc:creator>Gavin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Sep 2011 17:29:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9406</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I believe the one player that will help make a team is a good or great catcher. The royals don&#039;t have that. Look at the teams that are consistent they all have a good catcher. He makes the pitcher better and can bring power. Maybe there is hope for one real ace for a season the Rangers did it with cliff lee. Maybe we need a guy like that. Also some hgh wont be to bad for some of those guys. Its only illegal if you get caught. jk]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe the one player that will help make a team is a good or great catcher. The royals don&#8217;t have that. Look at the teams that are consistent they all have a good catcher. He makes the pitcher better and can bring power. Maybe there is hope for one real ace for a season the Rangers did it with cliff lee. Maybe we need a guy like that. Also some hgh wont be to bad for some of those guys. Its only illegal if you get caught. jk</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9230</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 25 Aug 2011 16:25:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9230</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;For the Royals to become contenders, they have to find some way to score more runs than they allow.&quot;

Brilliant!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;For the Royals to become contenders, they have to find some way to score more runs than they allow.&#8221;</p>
<p>Brilliant!</p>
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		<title>By: Greg</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9212</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 20:36:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9212</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Joe, 
I assume in your scenario Wilson is the 15mil name and Lee was the big name added.  That&#039;s good and well except Wilson made about 3 million last year.  The Royals might be able to afford one of the pieces you&#039;re describing, but even the Rangers situation highlights that Duffy, Monty, Odorizzi, whoever has to develop as an ace or near ace before you&#039;re even in that position.  Nobody save NY, BOS, PHILLY, etc can go out and add TWO players like that.  The Giants are another good example.  No one on their staff was getting paid 15mil unless you count Zito which I don&#039;t believe is the type of player you&#039;re after for that price tag.  Lincecum made 9 mil b/c he&#039;s under team control and the remaining staff were guys making a bit more than Kyle Davies.  The Royals are going to have to have a top of the rotation guy develop to be successful and they need more minor league candidates for aces before they can be sure they&#039;ll get even one from that group.  I&#039;m losing patience too, but 2012 is unlikely to be a year of contention and I think we all need to come that realization instead of dreaming the Glass/Moore are going to drop 100 million over 4-5 years on new pitchers for the staff.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joe,<br />
I assume in your scenario Wilson is the 15mil name and Lee was the big name added.  That&#8217;s good and well except Wilson made about 3 million last year.  The Royals might be able to afford one of the pieces you&#8217;re describing, but even the Rangers situation highlights that Duffy, Monty, Odorizzi, whoever has to develop as an ace or near ace before you&#8217;re even in that position.  Nobody save NY, BOS, PHILLY, etc can go out and add TWO players like that.  The Giants are another good example.  No one on their staff was getting paid 15mil unless you count Zito which I don&#8217;t believe is the type of player you&#8217;re after for that price tag.  Lincecum made 9 mil b/c he&#8217;s under team control and the remaining staff were guys making a bit more than Kyle Davies.  The Royals are going to have to have a top of the rotation guy develop to be successful and they need more minor league candidates for aces before they can be sure they&#8217;ll get even one from that group.  I&#8217;m losing patience too, but 2012 is unlikely to be a year of contention and I think we all need to come that realization instead of dreaming the Glass/Moore are going to drop 100 million over 4-5 years on new pitchers for the staff.</p>
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		<title>By: joe</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9203</link>
		<dc:creator>joe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 17:53:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9203</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Well... you don&#039;t &quot;build&quot; your rotation around starters, i guess, if you mean buy your 1-5 then no don&#039;t do that.


You do however probably need one big name, 15+M name to be the 1 or 2 and then, in a year you are competing well, you hit up the FA market around trade deadline for another big gun, like the rangers last year.  

C.J willson anchor then beef it up with Cliff lee at deadline, that seems like a really good  general plan, with the other 3 or 4 guys ( yes you probably want 6 capable arms, injurys) being home grown, or bargan vets like chen/frans.



I agree, if I had to guess who could start best of soria/crow/holland, it would be soria.  But that is with a BIG IF, if he can get control of his slow curve again.  He is after all a soft throwing rightly at 90-92mph, so he needs to have the batter on his heals to be effective.  There&#039;s a good chance he&#039;d always struggle with walks  and high pitch counts as a starter unless he gets that strike out curve, or some safe contact pitch under control.

Holland is interesting as a starter, he has a nice spliter? for a strike out pitch, but I think it would take a whole season to stretch him out to the point where he can give you innings as a starter.

Crow, is a one trick pony and just watching him I feel like his arm will fall off if he puts in starter innings, future closer.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well&#8230; you don&#8217;t &#8220;build&#8221; your rotation around starters, i guess, if you mean buy your 1-5 then no don&#8217;t do that.</p>
<p>You do however probably need one big name, 15+M name to be the 1 or 2 and then, in a year you are competing well, you hit up the FA market around trade deadline for another big gun, like the rangers last year.  </p>
<p>C.J willson anchor then beef it up with Cliff lee at deadline, that seems like a really good  general plan, with the other 3 or 4 guys ( yes you probably want 6 capable arms, injurys) being home grown, or bargan vets like chen/frans.</p>
<p>I agree, if I had to guess who could start best of soria/crow/holland, it would be soria.  But that is with a BIG IF, if he can get control of his slow curve again.  He is after all a soft throwing rightly at 90-92mph, so he needs to have the batter on his heals to be effective.  There&#8217;s a good chance he&#8217;d always struggle with walks  and high pitch counts as a starter unless he gets that strike out curve, or some safe contact pitch under control.</p>
<p>Holland is interesting as a starter, he has a nice spliter? for a strike out pitch, but I think it would take a whole season to stretch him out to the point where he can give you innings as a starter.</p>
<p>Crow, is a one trick pony and just watching him I feel like his arm will fall off if he puts in starter innings, future closer.</p>
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		<title>By: Tyler Dobson</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9190</link>
		<dc:creator>Tyler Dobson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 14:56:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9190</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I say we trade Gordon and Melky for pitching as soon as the season ends. They are two of our best players but our need for pitching is overwhelming. They also would have a higher return than most. Then next year we could throw in Cain and Maier or Myers to fill their spots and hopefully be ready to compete in 2013.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I say we trade Gordon and Melky for pitching as soon as the season ends. They are two of our best players but our need for pitching is overwhelming. They also would have a higher return than most. Then next year we could throw in Cain and Maier or Myers to fill their spots and hopefully be ready to compete in 2013.</p>
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		<title>By: ARMY SSG</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9189</link>
		<dc:creator>ARMY SSG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 14:53:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9189</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What would be wrong with trying Joakim Soria as a starter next season.  He might be growing tired of closing games all the time.  If he tries out as a starter and impresses next season to easy he could easily be a top of the line starter.  If he doesn&#039;t pan out as a starter in spring training move him back to the bullpen.  He is a guy with three our four quality pitches and honestly he reminds me of a young Greg Maddux.  What would be so wrong for the Royals to have Holland or any other of the young guns in the bullpen close out games?  If the Royals are only winning 60 games to 70 games a season do they really need a guy that has shown he can save 40 games a year.  Look at Smoltz once a closer then became top of the rotation talent then became closer again later in his career.  Its been mentioned before about Soria becoming a starter and he even gets more money as a starter(its written into his contract).  If you need a top of the line starter he might be it then all you would need to do is find another #3 Starter and see if your other talent can fill out the rest of the rotation. 

I have not always been sold on Bruce Chen but you have to admit the guy finds a way to win and if he can do that I would keep him around as a #4 or #5.  Chen does not have any pitch that is dominant but he is a younger Jaime Moyer.  I guy does not have to pitch 92 to 96 miles an hour to be a dominant starter.  Lots of Love from the Middle East.  

Peace be with you.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What would be wrong with trying Joakim Soria as a starter next season.  He might be growing tired of closing games all the time.  If he tries out as a starter and impresses next season to easy he could easily be a top of the line starter.  If he doesn&#8217;t pan out as a starter in spring training move him back to the bullpen.  He is a guy with three our four quality pitches and honestly he reminds me of a young Greg Maddux.  What would be so wrong for the Royals to have Holland or any other of the young guns in the bullpen close out games?  If the Royals are only winning 60 games to 70 games a season do they really need a guy that has shown he can save 40 games a year.  Look at Smoltz once a closer then became top of the rotation talent then became closer again later in his career.  Its been mentioned before about Soria becoming a starter and he even gets more money as a starter(its written into his contract).  If you need a top of the line starter he might be it then all you would need to do is find another #3 Starter and see if your other talent can fill out the rest of the rotation. </p>
<p>I have not always been sold on Bruce Chen but you have to admit the guy finds a way to win and if he can do that I would keep him around as a #4 or #5.  Chen does not have any pitch that is dominant but he is a younger Jaime Moyer.  I guy does not have to pitch 92 to 96 miles an hour to be a dominant starter.  Lots of Love from the Middle East.  </p>
<p>Peace be with you.</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9184</link>
		<dc:creator>Kyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 12:28:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9184</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Chris, I agree the Royals are not as bad as they were a few years ago.  I agree that I really like watching a homegrown team.  But this Royals team is not a GOOD team, it is a young and improving team.  Like you said, the starting pitching is horrible, so why would a team take Mazzaro or SOS, if they can&#039;t even start for this horrible rotation?  

I would like to see C.Rob in September, but as you mentioned he is blocked by the two best players on the team.  Can he learn another position (outfield)?  Probably not he is slow.  Dyson and Lough are having nice seasons in AAA, but they are probably not everyday players in MLB.  And there aren&#039;t many teams out there looking for that 4th outfielder to put them over the top.  Cain may be an everyday player, but you are right he is &quot;blocked&quot; by an outfield that is playing above what anyone thought when they were signed.  

The offense, defense, and bullpen are fun to watch for the most part.  It is still a young team that needs to grow quite a bit before it is playoff bound.  Two ACE starting pitchers might not have put this team over the top this year.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris, I agree the Royals are not as bad as they were a few years ago.  I agree that I really like watching a homegrown team.  But this Royals team is not a GOOD team, it is a young and improving team.  Like you said, the starting pitching is horrible, so why would a team take Mazzaro or SOS, if they can&#8217;t even start for this horrible rotation?  </p>
<p>I would like to see C.Rob in September, but as you mentioned he is blocked by the two best players on the team.  Can he learn another position (outfield)?  Probably not he is slow.  Dyson and Lough are having nice seasons in AAA, but they are probably not everyday players in MLB.  And there aren&#8217;t many teams out there looking for that 4th outfielder to put them over the top.  Cain may be an everyday player, but you are right he is &#8220;blocked&#8221; by an outfield that is playing above what anyone thought when they were signed.  </p>
<p>The offense, defense, and bullpen are fun to watch for the most part.  It is still a young team that needs to grow quite a bit before it is playoff bound.  Two ACE starting pitchers might not have put this team over the top this year.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Koester</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9183</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Koester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 12:13:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9183</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;If the prospects were that good, they would be starting for a very bad Royals team, right? So no one will take a package of C.Robinson, Dyson, Lough, Falu, SOS, Mazzaro, etc&quot;  ----&gt;  Terrible logic.  There are only a very limited number of roster spots.  Every one of these players has a clearly superior player or more highly considered prospect blocking their way right now.  There&#039;s no place for a 26 year old C. Rob with Hosmer and Butler in the way, Dyson, Lough and every other outfielder is stuck in neutral thanks to a surprisingly (shockingly?) productive veteran outfield this season.  

The fact is that the Royals are actually NOT a terrible team.  Dice up the stats and watch a few games...  They are actually a respectable team, except with abysmal starting pitching, which is THE unpardonable sin in baseball.  

Which brings us back to the point:  Assuming some reasonably expected progress among our crop of young position players, we are probably a couple of quality starters from being an over-.500 team.  This is NOT the same team that saddled Greinke with a sickening pile of weak run-support losses a couple of seasons ago.  

So what&#039;s the most likely track to getting there in the next season or two?  

For my part, I don&#039;t care for free agency.  I hate having a revolving door of players on the roster.  If I were a Yankees fan, I&#039;d hate baseball.  Right now I can watch a game where more than half of the starting lineup consists of players I&#039;ve seen play in person here in AA (big NWA Naturals fan!), in the past two seasons!  (Moose, Hos, Gia, Perez, Duffy...  and then the majority of the bullpen).  I&#039;d absolutely LOVE nothing more than to have a Royals team comprised 100% of our own homegrown talent...  it makes me feel so much more invested and interested in the team.  

Having said that, I&#039;ve also learned to enjoy watching hired guns like Frenchy and Cabrera do their thing for the Royals, despite the fact that my eyes have only recently stopped aching from rolling them so hard at last offseason&#039;s signings (just like you and everyone else) and I&#039;m pretty sure I wouldn&#039;t begrudge watching a free agent ace pitch us to an extra 8 wins a season, either.  ;)


Chris]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If the prospects were that good, they would be starting for a very bad Royals team, right? So no one will take a package of C.Robinson, Dyson, Lough, Falu, SOS, Mazzaro, etc&#8221;  &#8212;-&gt;  Terrible logic.  There are only a very limited number of roster spots.  Every one of these players has a clearly superior player or more highly considered prospect blocking their way right now.  There&#8217;s no place for a 26 year old C. Rob with Hosmer and Butler in the way, Dyson, Lough and every other outfielder is stuck in neutral thanks to a surprisingly (shockingly?) productive veteran outfield this season.  </p>
<p>The fact is that the Royals are actually NOT a terrible team.  Dice up the stats and watch a few games&#8230;  They are actually a respectable team, except with abysmal starting pitching, which is THE unpardonable sin in baseball.  </p>
<p>Which brings us back to the point:  Assuming some reasonably expected progress among our crop of young position players, we are probably a couple of quality starters from being an over-.500 team.  This is NOT the same team that saddled Greinke with a sickening pile of weak run-support losses a couple of seasons ago.  </p>
<p>So what&#8217;s the most likely track to getting there in the next season or two?  </p>
<p>For my part, I don&#8217;t care for free agency.  I hate having a revolving door of players on the roster.  If I were a Yankees fan, I&#8217;d hate baseball.  Right now I can watch a game where more than half of the starting lineup consists of players I&#8217;ve seen play in person here in AA (big NWA Naturals fan!), in the past two seasons!  (Moose, Hos, Gia, Perez, Duffy&#8230;  and then the majority of the bullpen).  I&#8217;d absolutely LOVE nothing more than to have a Royals team comprised 100% of our own homegrown talent&#8230;  it makes me feel so much more invested and interested in the team.  </p>
<p>Having said that, I&#8217;ve also learned to enjoy watching hired guns like Frenchy and Cabrera do their thing for the Royals, despite the fact that my eyes have only recently stopped aching from rolling them so hard at last offseason&#8217;s signings (just like you and everyone else) and I&#8217;m pretty sure I wouldn&#8217;t begrudge watching a free agent ace pitch us to an extra 8 wins a season, either.  <img src='http://royals.server310.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Chris</p>
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		<title>By: Kyle</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9182</link>
		<dc:creator>Kyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 11:37:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9182</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[FA is a terrible way for the Royals to build a rotation.  They just don&#039;t have the money to throw 20-25mil per year at 2-3 starters like the Phillies.  I mean I guess they do, if they get back to their 65-75mil payroll.  But thats still about a 1/3 of the payroll invested in one guy.  You would think there would be a package in the minors to deal, but they probably aren&#039;t in AAA.  

If the prospects were that good, they would be starting for a very bad Royals team, right?  So no one will take a package of C.Robinson, Dyson, Lough, Falu, SOS, Mazzaro, etc.  It&#039;s going to be tough to find a buyer using Myers, Dwyer, Lamb, Cuthbert, Adam and I really don&#039;t want them to give up on any of those five.  Developing starting pitching is the way the Royals have to do it.  But it does take time and A LOT of pitching prospects.  

In the next 3 years they need to have a 3 out of Duffy, Monty, Dwyer, Lamb, Odorizzi, Adam, Arguelles, Ventura, Yambati, W.Smith, Marks in the rotation.  Then Hoch, Paulino, SOS, Mazzaro need to fill the 4 &amp; 5 spots.  They &quot;could&quot; get one middle of the road FA, but they need one of that first group to REALLY step up and be the ACE.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FA is a terrible way for the Royals to build a rotation.  They just don&#8217;t have the money to throw 20-25mil per year at 2-3 starters like the Phillies.  I mean I guess they do, if they get back to their 65-75mil payroll.  But thats still about a 1/3 of the payroll invested in one guy.  You would think there would be a package in the minors to deal, but they probably aren&#8217;t in AAA.  </p>
<p>If the prospects were that good, they would be starting for a very bad Royals team, right?  So no one will take a package of C.Robinson, Dyson, Lough, Falu, SOS, Mazzaro, etc.  It&#8217;s going to be tough to find a buyer using Myers, Dwyer, Lamb, Cuthbert, Adam and I really don&#8217;t want them to give up on any of those five.  Developing starting pitching is the way the Royals have to do it.  But it does take time and A LOT of pitching prospects.  </p>
<p>In the next 3 years they need to have a 3 out of Duffy, Monty, Dwyer, Lamb, Odorizzi, Adam, Arguelles, Ventura, Yambati, W.Smith, Marks in the rotation.  Then Hoch, Paulino, SOS, Mazzaro need to fill the 4 &amp; 5 spots.  They &#8220;could&#8221; get one middle of the road FA, but they need one of that first group to REALLY step up and be the ACE.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris Koester</title>
		<link>http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419&#038;cpage=1#comment-9181</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Koester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2011 06:42:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.royalsauthority.com/?p=4419#comment-9181</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Jorge:  Are you referring to the same Glass whose team just handed out all-time record signing bonus money to this year&#039;s draft class?  Not sure I&#039;m following you.

I think at least one big free agent starter HAS to be a part of the plan.  While I&#039;d love to grow all of our own talent, pitching is just too hit-and-miss (look at the recent fortunes of blue chippers like Duffy, Montgomery, Lamb et al) to count on developing your own starting rotation on a predictable timeline.  As well as the Royals have done drafting and developing position players in recent years, we&#039;ve had sort of the opposite luck with pitching.

With all the various spare parts currently stocked up in the minor league system, and the high value assigned to prospects right now, a free agent starter or two feels like the savvy move.  Clint Robinson isn&#039;t getting any younger.  ;)

&quot;free agency is a terrible, terrible way to build a rotation.&quot;  &lt;--- Apparently Philly didn&#039;t get this memo?


Chris]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jorge:  Are you referring to the same Glass whose team just handed out all-time record signing bonus money to this year&#8217;s draft class?  Not sure I&#8217;m following you.</p>
<p>I think at least one big free agent starter HAS to be a part of the plan.  While I&#8217;d love to grow all of our own talent, pitching is just too hit-and-miss (look at the recent fortunes of blue chippers like Duffy, Montgomery, Lamb et al) to count on developing your own starting rotation on a predictable timeline.  As well as the Royals have done drafting and developing position players in recent years, we&#8217;ve had sort of the opposite luck with pitching.</p>
<p>With all the various spare parts currently stocked up in the minor league system, and the high value assigned to prospects right now, a free agent starter or two feels like the savvy move.  Clint Robinson isn&#8217;t getting any younger.  <img src='http://royals.server310.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>&#8220;free agency is a terrible, terrible way to build a rotation.&#8221;  &lt;&#8212; Apparently Philly didn&#039;t get this memo?</p>
<p>Chris</p>
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